I know I’m not the only one, but I find it very difficult to concentrate immediately following a national tragedy (whether it’s natural or man made). Obviously, I have strong feelings about this topic and come to this with my own biases, but here are some of the things I heard and learned yesterday as I argued with friends and strangers about guns:
1) When I mentioned something like stricter gun laws, or gun law reform, or improving gun laws, most of the gun owners responding seemed to hear my words as: I want to take your guns away. Even though I never suggested or hinted at such a thing. So that makes it hard to start a fruitful conversation. I’m still trying to figure out how to solve that glitch. Maybe if I start comments with “I definitely want you to be able to keep your guns, but….”
2) Based on wide polling, most Americans, whether they own guns or not, are totally in favor of things like universal background checks, and eliminating gun purchase loopholes at gun shows, and not allowing people on the no-fly list to buy guns. These things just make common sense. The vast majority of us are actually all on the same team as far as being on board with gun control. Which is great news.
So why can’t we make some progress in this area? Well, this isn’t something I learned yesterday, but a lot of it comes down to the NRA. Even though initiatives like I mentioned have wide bipartisan public support, the NRA is powerful enough and gives our representatives (both Democrat and Republican) so much money, that they can prevent legislation from passing. Which is what happened to the proposed legislation following Sandy Hook.
3) Though many countries (including ones with similar cultures to ours like Canada and Australia) have largely solved their gun problems, there are a whole lot of people who aren’t willing to look at what works elsewhere. There seems to be an idea that America is too different from every other country. I mean, I realize it truly is a unique situation, but I still think we can learn from other countries.
4) There are so many responsible gun owners in our country. They get proper training and follow the laws and go through the background checks. Which is fantastic. There are also a lot of people who consider themselves responsible gun owners but sleep with a gun under their pillow while parenting very young children in the same house. Do I think that’s an example of responsible gun ownership? Personally, no. But it brings up a good point: What does responsible gun ownership look like? There is no official definition, and I didn’t see much consensus on this in yesterday’s discussions.
I think it would be helpful if the idea of responsible gun ownership was more defined and agreed upon, because from what I can tell, it seems like it would align with fairly strict gun regulation. Which (no surprise) I’m on board with.
5) Speaking of responsible gun owners, every single one I asked would be totally fine if semi-automatic assault rifles were severely limited in availability or not sold at all. That seems like a good unifying thing, a point we could all rally behind. Everyone seems to understand that these are not tools used to protect families, they are used attack and to kill a lot of people at once.
6) When the topic of gun law reform is brought up, there are a limited number of arguments that status quo gun advocates will present. And yesterday they were presented over and over again. Perhaps they will be presented in the comments below. They boil down to these:
– more laws won’t work
– guns don’t kill people, people kill people
– it’s not appropriate to discuss this right now
– you can’t talk about this unless you’ve already eliminated abortion and solved alcohol-related deaths
– the status quo is working fine for me and I don’t want things to change
– it’s a “heart” problem, not a gun problem
– it’s a mental health problem, not a gun problem
– any gun law changes will punish responsible gun-owners
– evil people will be evil even without guns
– we already have really strict gun laws
– there’s nothing that can be done
I understand these arguments were offered sincerely in some cases, but personally I find them to be pretty weak (or examples of straw men), and I spent a lot of time responding to them yesterday. Ultimately, they seem to be a distraction from what people are really feeling. Which is:
7) There are a whole lot of Americans that are 100% convinced they will need to defend their family at gun point. Today, tomorrow, or sometime in the future. And to this particular group (which is a LOT of people), owning a gun, and spending time training how to use it, is simply what is required to be a responsible adult or responsible parent. A worthy goal.
The problem I have with this goal, is that it doesn’t really seem to be justified from a non-emotional standpoint. If shown statistics that they are more likely to get hit by lightening than they are to have to defend their family at gun point, it doesn’t change their thinking even a little bit. If shown reports that it’s been proven that homes with guns are actually less safe than homes without, they think their home is the exception. If told that data shows their guns are more likely to cause harm to an innocent family member than a criminal, they block that fact out.
They sincerely believe their family is or will be under attack. And the only thing that calms their fear, or makes them feel prepared for the oncoming attack, is owning a gun.
I understand that their feelings on this are real and powerful. I get that. I really do. The thing I can’t figure out is: where does the idea that we will need to defend our families at gun point come from? Because I don’t have that idea in my head at all, and it’s hard for me to comprehend. I mean, I get wanting to protect my family, but I don’t associate that desire with guns.
8) In a discussion about the NRA, someone brought up the history of the tobacco lobby. Apparently, for many years they were hugely influential, and it was thought that nothing could overcome them. But here we are today, and smoking isn’t allowed in restaurants, in airports, on campuses or in most publics spaces. Things have changed drastically. The tipping point seemed to be putting into words that one citizen’s rights couldn’t infringe on the health and safety of another citizen.
If we allow members of our community to gather a personal collection of semi-automatic rifles over a few years or even decades, with no knowledge of how they are stored or maintained, are we putting their rights above the safety of the community?
What would it take to overcome the influence of the NRA?
9) The way gun owners spoke yesterday about mental health was troubling to me. Part of why they are confident in their gun ownership is because they see themselves as mentally healthy. But bodies are tricky. They change. And sometimes change very quickly. You’re healthy one month and the next month you have cancer. The brain is part of the body and it can change quickly too. Ben Blair’s great-grandfather was President of BYU. He also committed suicide because of depression. Bodies change. Often without warning or awareness that the change has happened.
Yes, you’re a healthy, responsible gun owner today, with a tidy personal collection of firearms. But when you hit a mid-life crisis will it be as safe for you to have easy access to guns? How about when you become older and senile or forgetful? How about when your teens go from happy-go-lucky to depressed and suicidal over night?
10) What I’d like to see? More sensible regulation and lots of it. We could start with what we require of drivers and car owners. Things like registration for all guns, required to be renewed yearly. Regular physical inspections of all guns to make sure they are working properly and have not been altered in a harmful way. Universal gun licensing with ongoing renewals and physical check ups to make sure gun owners are of sound mind and body. I would LOVE to see a nationwide gun buyback modeled after what was done in Australia. I know people have invested a lot of money in their guns and it would be great if they could get that investment back while doing something good for their community. I think semi-automatic firearms should be illegal and not sold period (and old models not grandfathered in either which is what has happened with automatic rifles). I think it should be very difficult to be able to get a permit to sell guns, and that guns should only be sold in a very small number of regulated shops. I think we should limit the amount of ammunition that can be purchased. I would like to see gun laws unified across the country, because we don’t have checkpoints at state lines, and it’s too easy to buy a firearm in one state and bring it to another. I could go on, but I’ll stop there.
Notice that none of these ideas mean guns are being taken from people against their will. None of these ideas mean someone can’t protect their family. None of these ideas prevent hunters from participating in their sport or from providing meat for their family.
Would these ideas 100% eliminate gun violence in America? Not likely. Would they reduce the amount of gun violence in America. It seems so. And hey, at the request of 2nd amendment enthusiasts, we’ve tried the status quo for a long time now and we know gun violence has only gotten worse. Isn’t it time to try some ideas from another point of view?
What’s your take? Do you own guns? If yes, how do you define “responsible gun ownership?” Is your main reason for owning guns to protect your family? Or perhaps you’re a hunter? Are there any ideas I suggested that you feel are extreme? And as a gun owner, what changes would you suggest to reduce gun violence in our country?
For those of you who are not gun owners, what are your thoughts? Have you read anything lately that changed your thinking about guns in some way? And when you think about protecting your family, since you don’t own a gun, what comes to mind instead? For me, it’s stuff like a living will and life insurance.
How did you talk to your kids about Las Vegas? Would love to hear your thoughts.
P.S. — Want to put things in numbers perspective? This very short article stunned me. Also, this is helpful: Gun violence in America, explained in 17 maps and charts.
P.P.S — If you’re tempted to bring up Chicago or “black-on-black crime,” please don’t. I’m not okay with race-baiting while we discuss this topic (or any other time).
Just read an interesting tweet… Government insists that the Vegas shooter’s gun arsenal is a ‘right’ but medical treatment for the 500+ survivors and mental health needs of people who turn to guns as weapons is merely a ‘privilege.’ Oh my…
ugh.
Thank you. I have been eagerly awaiting your response to the events in Las Vegas. I had a feeling you would be able to take my tangled thoughts and put them into words. You did that and more. You have pointed out so many of the flaws with our systems, regulations, and rationalizations surrounding gun ownership. This is a powerful, thought-provoking piece. Bravo.
Thank you for reading and commenting, Mari.
Thank you for this very well-thought out and rationale post. I also appreciate your willingness to go to bat for what you believe in on FB. I was impressed with the volume of comments you took the time to make. I appreciate your tobacco lobby example here because it gives me hope that the NRA can eventually be wrangled into some level of submission in the benefit of public health as well.
Also, of note is that Mike Bloomberg is currently matching donations to Everytown for Gun Safety, something I’m very impressed with. http://every.tw/2xflti9 Even though I love bashing the insanity of the NRA, I believe I personally need to do more than just bash the NRA by giving this and other similar organizations the funding they need so that they can fight fire with fire.
Thank you so much for the Michael Bloomberg tip!
I am a GP in the UK and here every gun has to be licensed with the Police. They then check with the GP there is no objection or worry about this person owning a gun. Every time I open the electronic clinical notes of a patient with a gun it alerts me to the fact that they have a gun licence. I live in a rural community where many people are gamekeepers or participate in pheasant shooting etc. When a situation arises where the mental health of the patient may impact on the judgment of that patient we can then inform the Police and they will assess whether the licence can continue or the guns need to be removed. Although this is a small number of people I find it to be an excellent system as the decision to remove the guns doesn’t lie with a medical practitioner, with whom a therapeutic relationship has to be maintained, but with the Police.
Thank you so much for leaving this comment. I’ve already referenced it in a response above. I think it’s a good example of how we can build nuance into something like gun legislation.
I’m so glad you are speaking up. I agree with everything you’ve said, and I am really struggling to understand all the arguments to the contrary. Someone mentioned above that her Dad feels he has a God-given right to own a semi-automatic weapon. I’m sorry, WHAT? I just so fundamentally don’t understand this, and it’s making me crazy that the NRA has so much power. Politicians should take a pledge that they won’t take money from them. #inmydreams
Does everything come down to raising more money as a unified group than the NRA? So depressing.
I apologize, I’m too fatigued by the photos of the beautiful people who were gunned down this week in Las Vegas and the strident pro-gun/NRA comments to write anything as thoughtful as your previous commenters. But I couldn’t just read this post and move on without saying thank you for writing it.
Kris
I just need to add one more thing. My husband is a former police officer – now in another career – and he will not have a gun in the house. He doesn’t believe anyone, especially with children should have a weapon in the house, because statistically it’s someone in the house who will be injured or killed by that weapon. And no, we do not fear for the safety of our family.
I appreciate you noting this, Kris. I think many American gun owners would assume the opposite — that a former police officer would want a gun at home. When someone who had to carry a gun routinely for work knows they aren’t safe to have in homes with kids, I think it carries more weight.
Have as many guns as you like. Tax ammunition- $5 a round for the basic stuff, more for more sophisticated stuff- hollow point bullets, etc.
Government is tax-exempt, so it won’t impact police or military budgets.
The hunters in my family have to purchase expensive game licenses and then spend a long time waiting, watching to get one or two shots. A few more $$ on the ammunition should not be a deterrent to hunters.
Develop non-lethal ammunition for target sports, that is not subject to the tax.
Use the money from the ammunition tax to fund mental health services.
I’m very intrigued by this idea. Is ammunition something someone could DIY at home?
Yes, if you have spent rounds, you can fill them back up with gun powder so they’re usable again. Individuals who regularly shoot at ranges will often do that, as it’s a part of what they enjoy about gun ownership. I would say the average individual wouldn’t have the inclination to learn how to do it, as it’s obviously something you’d need training on, and have the proper tools.
Both my family and my ILs have guns. My dad is in law enforcement, and he was adamant about gun safety at home. My husband grew up shooting in competitions. We each own a handgun, and have a rifle and shotgun. We enjoy shooting at ranges, and do have our concealed carry permits.
All guns are stored unloaded and locked, in a safe. Ammunition is stored separately, also locked away. Our child will never know the combinations. He will take gun safety courses as he gets older. Should he (or us) exhibit suicidal tendencies when he’s older (he’s 2), the guns are out of the house.
We’re also not allowing realistic toy guns (NERF or super soakers are still up for debate) or shooting games, as we take the mentality that children should not be encouraged to think of guns as “play.” They are serious, and if handled improperly, dangerous. Pretending to kill someone with guns in play, including video games, is disgusting to me.
I like to think we’re responsible gun owners. Both of us think more regulations should be in place, and the guns the shooter used in Las Vegas should not be available for purchase. Mental health checks are a must. I’m incredibly intrigued by what the English GP posted about how they manage it.
I would be fine if a parent asked me about if we had guns, and I would be happy to show them how they’re secured. If they’re uncomfortable with their children at our home, I’d 100% support that, as it is their right as parents. I plan on asking the same question, as well as if alcohol, edibles (we live in Colorado), and porn are secured in their homes.
Lastly, the paranoia around needing guns in the event of martial law is beyond me. If that happens, I’ll have bigger concerns than if the government knows I have guns. We’ve walked out of a few 5th Sunday lessons on being prepared that turned into saying guns were a part of food storage/prep (all in Utah, as you’d imagine!).
This is a great post and discussion, even though I’m obviously in a different camp than most here.
Thank you. This perfectly says what I’ve been thinking. I’m sharing far and wide.
Thanks for reading and sharing.
Amen to your #10 and your P.P.S!
Thanks, Rosie!
As a Canadian who spent seven years studying in the US, I just wanted to make a few comments on this tragic situation. I was reading the post with interest until I got to this sentence, “Though many countries (including ones with similar cultures to ours like Canada and Australia) have largely solved their gun problems…”.
I kind of stopped there for a moment…”including ones with similar cultures to ours….” On this topic, specifically, similarity comes to an end. Aside from any legal battles/discussion around gun laws, etc., I really think that even more important than changing the law is a real cultural shift. I found it almost creepy how fond Americans are of their guns.
I find the statistic interesting that so many don’t own guns–but what percentage of those (who don’t own) uphold others’ rights to own guns? It just seems common sense that the more guns there are, the more violence/accidents, etc., etc. there will be. The self defence mentality is what needs shifting first of all (and of course legislation to support that–but a law can change and many people still think differently than the law).
Also, how much does military culture foster attitudes towards guns, etc.? This is a question I have as an outside observer. The military culture in the US is also very different compared to other countries (this is not meant to be a criticism of the military–it is just a question I have about a population’s exposure to weapons on a wider scale, etc.).
I do think it is really important to realize that in other countries there simply is not this same obsession with guns, the right to own guns or this manner of promoting self-defence. The statistics do seem to speak for themselves.
I appreciate the observations. In case you’re curious why I named Australia and Canada as having similar cultures to the U.S., I was thinking about factors like all 3 are English speaking, all 3 are Western culture, all 3 cover broad geographic areas, all 3 are relatively young countries, all 3 have a bit of a wild west/cowboy reputation in some parts of the country. I wasn’t thinking about similar gun culture at all — I don’t think anyone has a similar gun culture to America. Ours is super strange. But I can totally see how would think that’s what I was referencing.
I feel compelled to comment as someone who witnessed a crazy person open fire on innocent people in a shopping mall. This was in 1985 and I was 16. Having grown up with little experience or knowledge of guns I was completely unprepared for what I heard and saw when a person open fire in the mall. This experience has definitely shaped my opinions on guns. I share my experience with people who are close to me and not with the wide world… until now. What is it going to take to stop this from happening to innocent people? Having witnessed the horror and carnage I feel as if guns make me feel less safe and vulnerable to another persons mental health. I agree completely with the idea of clarifying what gun safety is and enforcing it in the same way we do cars and driving are a good start to solving this public health issue.
Oh Jackie. I can’t imagine how terrifying and traumatic that must have been. And 16 is so young. I’m sorry you had to experience that. Thanks for commenting here.
Thank you so very much for this thoughtful post. You’ve gotten me thinking: How in the world did I manage to become who I am today, with the opinion I do about guns?
I grew up with a grandfather with guns. My uncle had guns. I was taught how to shoot a BB gun at 9. I asked for, and got, my own BB gun at 10.
Today, I’m a mom of two boys, who doesn’t allow Nurf guns in the house. We don’t play pretend anything that resembles guns. And, like you, I’m much more concerned about having a will in place to make sure my family is secure. The concept of having a gun to protect us is downright foreign. (The husband agrees.)
Yes, when I was 18, a dear friend’s younger brother was accidentally shot and killed by a friend who wanted to show off his dad’s gun. That was likely my tipping point.
Do I want to take away people’s rights to guns? I can’t say I do. Do I want responsible gun ownership? YES. In some states, if you have a swimming pool you’re required to have a fence to protect others. The whole concept of additional insurance is genius….homeowners insurance is higher with a trampoline or pool; life insurance is more expensive if you’re in a profession considered dangerous. Why not have additional insurance for gun owners? Hell, even give them a small discount for certain in-home safes. (Just like I get for having a home security system.)
I don’t have a good point, but felt like I could share in this forum. We need to do and be better. The 2nd Amendment was written when guns didn’t have the potential to send off hundreds of bullets in seconds. It’s scary when a huge faction of our fellow Americans care more about everyone (including the mentally ill, no fly list, etc) having unencumbered access to any kind of gun at any time than the health and safety of their fellow man. I just don’t get it.
I’m glad you felt comfortable sharing here, and I think the questions you’re asking yourself are questions all Americans should be asking ourselves.
Thank you so much for writing this. I agree with everything and it is so nice to see my thoughts put to paper in such an eloquent and smart way. Can you run for office? Thank you for always providing such a great perspective.
and I love your PPS! I live in Chicago!
The Chicago arguments kill me. Ugh. People can be awful.
On top of the restrictions mentioned, I would add military service and training. That seems way more patriotic than selling one’s sou to the NRA. They do it in Israel. They do it in Switzerland. I’m sure they do it elsewhere but those are the only two I know much about.
I don’t know if they still do, but when we lived in Greece, military service was required.
Someone breaking into my home is definitely a fear of mine (usually only when I am home with kids sans husband at night), maybe I am being paranoid but it does happen. But your numbers and stats on the dangers of guns in thr home have me thinking I should swap for a big dog for my home defence 😫
A big dog or a loud dog — both seem very effective. : )
A dog is actually the number one thing you can do to prevent home invasion. But that is just according to the people who teach army operational security.
Here in the north state where I live I was surprised to find out that lots of things are less regulated: you don’t need a safety and emissions test to register your car, your drivers license is renewed after 8 years instead of 5, things like window tint are also not regulated. You literally do not need a teaching degree to be hired as a teacher and you can get a lifetime certification that never needs to be renewed. In other words, where I live people are used to fewer regulations and may oppose gun regulation on that alone. Interestingly, on a side note, the health care is great and amazingly inexpensive compared to other states we’ve lived in. Maybe that’s a positive result of fewer regulations somehow.
I bring this up simply to say that some people simply don’t want more government overreach and I think that plays an important part in gun control. As for myself, I don’t own one and think they ought to be much more regulated because of the obvious potential for harm. I’d go so far as to ask why we even allow the illegal ones to be produced. I do enjoy shooting though I haven’t been in over 15 years.
I also really appreciated the comment above who mentioned keeping regulations equal– so we don’t get a bunch of armed rich folk and unarmed poor. That’s something that must be planned on from the beginning of regulation
“I bring this up simply to say that some people simply don’t want more government overreach and I think that plays an important part in gun control.”
Really good point. I think that’s very true. There are other instances where we’ve required safety (requiring seat belts and carseats, eliminating second hand smoke from public spaces), and I hope the same thing happens here.
On my Instagram feed, someone said we need to frame this as a Public Health Crisis instead of a Gun Problem, and I think that could actually be effective.
I haven’t read all the comments, so maybe someone else mentioned this, but as it relates to #7… I have started to wonder if some of this is ingrained in some of our culture because of the Revolutionary War. If the population at the time had not had access to guns, they wouldn’t have been able to defend themselves and declare their independence from the British. It’s one of the reasons we have the second amendment, yes? So I often wonder if some of that fear and culture has been passed down. Maybe that sounds silly? I’ve also heard the argument that we are a harder nation to invade and take over our physical borders because we do have such a large portion of citizens that own guns.
I’m sure some of it has been passed down. Then again, we are also a nation of immigrants. A huge number of Americans don’t have relatives that were here during the Revolutionary War. On my mom’s side, come of my ancestors were, but on my dad’s side, they were not.
Great post! I read some of the comments on your Facebook page yesterday, and I commend you for fighting the good fight. I throw my hands up at the whole debate because it boggles my mind that it’s such a debate at all. But I’m a Canadian who has only been living in the US a year and selfishly bury my head in the sand to avoid being overwhelmed by the senseless reality and futility of it all.
For the most part, I’ve given up on this actually changing in America. As a society, this country values individual freedom over common good. It’s why there’s no universal health care either. I’ve literally heard most Canadians I know say at some point, “I don’t mind paying a bit more in taxes so everyone can have good health care and education.” I lived in Sweden for a few years, and Swedes seem to be like-minded. Canadians (and people in countless other western countries) see ourselves as a group who are “in this together” for lack of a better phrase. That’s not present-day America. Government policies and laws regulate the common good, yet so many Americans see regulation as limitation, a personal affront to their personal freedom and choice.
All that said, something you pointed out gives me a glimpse of hope – the fact that the tobacco industry was finally regulated. So a Goliath of a problem can be tackled. But can today’s America really tackle it? Only if all Americans remember that “the well being of others, even strangers, impacts their own,” as Krista Tippett said.
The history of the tobacco lobby gives me hope too.
This post has really opened my eyes and heart.
I never owned a gun and didn’t grow up with a gun in the house.
But lately I been thinking about owning one to [protect my family].
But the question I keep asking myself is what’s my motive?
And the same answer keeps popping up in my spirit and it’s FEAR of what might happen if someone breaks into my home with a gun.
I’m going to keep praying on this one because I’m 51 years old and no one haven’t broke into it yet.
I can’t live in fear of what might happen. I mean where is my faith in God if I do?
Thanks for the insight.
“I can’t live in fear of what might happen.”
I agree!
#7 “where does the idea that we will need to defend our families at gun point come from? ” That!
I really don’t know. But the more I read, the more I realize it’s a smaller percentage of Americans than I thought who believe this. Maybe that’s hopeful?
Wow. What a powerful essay! Loved it and the comments. I agree with Olivia as she stated how I really feel. Just as an FYI, I will never under any conditions own a gun (I’m a 69 yr old gramma) because someone in our family murdered another family member in a fit of rage with a gun “kept to protect their home” 30 years ago. Congress needs to stand up to the NRA and also not accept their money. Congress needs to make mental illness healthcare a priority.
Oh. That’s awful. Having access to a gun turns a momentary instance of rage lethal. I’m so sorry.
I am stumbling over what I want to say about this (none of it good) so I will just post the link.
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/10/05/after-vegas-shooting-bump-stock-is-hot-at-gun-stores.html
I saw that on Twitter this morning and a pit formed in my stomach. It’s so gross. Before this week, I didn’t understand what a small percentage of Americans actually own guns. The math is startling. There are 300 million guns in America, and only 23% of Americans own guns. I imagine a good chunk of those gun owners only own one or two. Which means there are a whole lot of gun owners that basically have a personal arsenal, just like the shooter in Vegas.
If someone told me their Uncle had a collection of 25 guns, and that he collected them in case ISIS attacked him, I would think: Hmmm. Sounds like your uncle is paranoid and not mentally healthy.
And that gets me thinking that we probably have a whole lot of mentally unhealthy people with personal arsenals of guns. Which means we’re likely sitting on a whole pile of future mass killings.
If someone amasses an arsenal, at some point, they’ll want to use it. To me, it would be reasonable to put anyone buying the product that made the Las Vegas massacre possible on a watchlist, and investigated as a potential threat to our society.
To Gabby…Design Mom:)
I’m a big fan of yours, been reading you for years. I am not the most eloquent so forgive any missteps. I know I don’t speak for all gun owners.
Full disclosure:
I am a moderate conservative, but definitely lean more liberally.
I am not a member of any political party.
I did not grow up around guns.
My husband did.
My husband and I own 2 rifles and 2 handguns, which we don’t currently have in our home, because we live overseas.
I think you can be in support of the 2nd amendment and also support gun control.
At least half of our extensive family are gun owners and none of them are members of the NRA, so I can’t speak to that aspect.
I am in full support of nationwide gun laws, to help get rid of the many loopholes in gun control. I am in favor of banning some assault type guns. I am in favor of extensive background checks and wait times. I am in favor of gun registration and laws about how they are kept (locked up etc…) I am in favor of requiring gun safety classes/tests at regular intervals. I am in favor of stricter punishments for gun crime. And probably more, but that’s all that currently comes to mind.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but part of the purpose of this post is to figure out how to have a better dialogue with people against stricter gun laws, right?
So I’m gonna go down through your points and tell you what I see…for whatever my opinion is worth to you, considering you don’t know me at all, ha!
1)if you started with the comment “I definitely want you to be able to keep your guns, but…” you’d be flat out lying. 😬 so maybe that’s not the right word, since to me lie means intent to deceive, but that’s how your words could be perceived. In comments on this very post you agree with people saying there should be no guns. Despite seemingly popular opinion about the intelligence of most gun owners they can read between the lines. So…ya don’t bother saying that part.
2)this is part of the reason I wish we could do away with political parties. Also maybe because the majority already want gun control laws the few, but loud crazies don’t need to be addressed? It’s our “representatives” that need the real talking to. (Oops my conservative side is coming out in my distrust for those that represent us will actually do what we want)
3)agreed
4)I’m on board with this
5)yep
6)I am totally for gun control reform. None of the responses you list to me are valid against reform. But they aren’t really responding to fear of reform they’re responding to the fear the government will confiscate their guns. They hear the undercurrent of most of these conversations that really want to take away all the guns. So the old adage makes sense to them, Give them an inch they’ll take a mile. So they refuse the inch, even if they actually see the good of it.
7)they just aren’t finishing the sentence fully. They want their guns as a defense against the government. The 2nd amendment was about protecting yourself from those in power over you. You have to understand that Conservatives, in general, hold a large distrust of the Government. Their logic might go, if the government decides to get rid of all guns and my guns are registered then they can come get my guns. Or if there’s a banned list of people what’s to stop them from just adding my name to that list for no reason? They don’t say this because it is often laughed off, and they get it can sound crazy so they just talk about defending their family. Trust me 99% are not living in constant fear and paranoia.
8)don’t know anything really about the NRA
9)This point again has the undercurrent of we can’t trust anyone with a gun, you all might turn on me tomorrow, so take away all the guns.
Like I said before I am for laws that would require regular checkups.
That being said more mental health care would be great!
10)agree
So in conclusion how do you calm the fears of someone that you don’t want to take away their guns yet, but just put stricter laws in place…that really you are hoping will lead to all the guns being taken away….
Well at least be honest and upfront about it. When they hear the lie, or the “for now” undertone of the words they think you have a secret agenda.
So maybe you could say
“I hope to live in a world without guns, but I will settle for laws that make everyone safer….”
at least it’s a good open starting point instead of trying to convince people you don’t want to take away their guns…cause you do…eventually:)
A couple of additional thoughts-cause this wasn’t long enough yet! Ha.
I would be interested in knowing the statistics of percentage of gun owners that their guns are used to commit a crime. (Did that make sense?)
One more thing I hear from anti- control people is about Obama. I believe you mentioned on your Facebook page in a comment the fears conservatives had that Obama would take away their guns. And it didn’t happen. Well the anti-controls people believe that the only thing that stopped it from happening was stopping new gun control laws from being put in place. Just food for thought.
I really enjoy these deep discussions you are more than willing to have. Especially on these platforms where meanings can be so easily misunderstood. I took the time to write this because I believe you want to help and you want to make the world better, so know there’s nothing snarky in my response. Thanks!
OK. Lets start of by saying that I, like I believe a lot of people are, am firmly in the middle. This two party system really leaves me partiless and have to decide which ones strongest stance is the lest terrible. Want to change anything we first need to change our political landscape. I follow both sides, which by the way I hate having to say, so as to be informed.
Some of what I’ll say I’m not going to expand a lot on as even though a copy cat or terrorist probably does not read this blog I’d rater not take the chance. Email me if you must know and I’ll think about it. For instance the Vegas shooter was obviously not a gun person and it’s agood thing he wasn’t.
I’ll go through your points somewhat in order but they are a bit intertwined.
I am a gun owner. I use them for hunting and for target practice.
#1 You may not wan’t to take the guns, although you do contradict that later on, many really do. And like many things in politics a lot of laws get really nonsensical things tacked on and therefore never passed. Like in my state they wanted universal background checks. That’s fine until it got perverted that what that meant was I couldn’t hand my rifle to my mother at a gun range without having a background check done, and then another one for me when she handed it back.
#2 Who would pay for these background checks and where? There really isn’t a gun show loophole it’s a personal sale. Most sellers at gun shows are dealers and as such still do the same check as at their shop. Honestly most gun people I know wouldn’t buy a gun from a private seller without ensuring it functioned and that’s not possible at a show. As for the no fly list, that sounds like a no brainer with the caveat that the list needs to be handled much better. Kids are on it and you can be placed on it for no reason with little recourse to defend yourself if placed incorrectly. The NRA is obnoxious and all lobbyist should be banned from funding political figures. Statistically speaking phamaceutical lobbyists have done far more damage than the NRA.
#3 Biggest problem with this is that their constitution does not have a clause about limiting guns. Furthermore they really haven’t fixed the problem. A simple search shows that Australia has had mass shootings since their ban. Only a few but given their population it’s almost on par with the US. There is also a huge black market which only puts money in the pockets of the big bad guys.
#4 Responsible gun ownership. Going back to the NRA, when they were first started they sponsored hunters safety courses and the like. You still have to take this course to hunt in most places and it is a fantastic program. I would say everyone that has a gun should have to do this. It’s not hard.
I have a secured gun safe and kids in the home. They have been taught from a very young age about gun safety. No guns are accessable on the rare times they are home alone. I tend to have one available when I am home, not for a home invasion scenario, but because we raise our own animals for food and there is a fisher cat who really wants to get at the chickens.
#5 I believe you talked to a very limited amount of like minded people. Like I told a co worker if you can’t learn the terminology no extreme gun nut is going to even listen to you. You use semi-auto and assault rifle in the same sentence. These are two different things. A very large portion of rifles sold are semi auto, and every single one can have cosmetic things put on them to look like an assault rife yet the function does not change at all. An assault rifle by definition has the ability to switch from single fire to full auto. These are so restrictive to get they basically are banned to the average citizen.
#’s 6 and 7 Some of these are the underlying problem, and some are out there. If you want to be unemotional why the uproar when something terrible happens and not the other preventable causes of death? The anti gun people scoff at this but more people die in car crashes yearly than by a gun but you can get a car that exceeds the highest posted speed limit in the country. And to stay unemotional lets break down the gun deaths. The last FBI database states that 33 thousand people die from gun shots. Of those 83% were not violent crime scenarios but suicide, law enforcement shootings, and going back to responsible gun ownership accidental discharge. Extrapolating from the remaining 17% that were violent crimes, which is 5,100 people, 25% were in four cities which all happen to have extremely strict gun laws.
#8 No idea other than the above mentioned not allowing any lobby group to give money to political causes. The NRA does do some good in that they actually read proposed legislation carefully which can’t be said of some of out senators.
#9 Most of this is true, and I hate to say it but removing guns will not stop suicides. Saying a mid life crisis would make a gun owner do something like what happened in Vegas sounds is a stretch though. And as for senility, again if they become violent there are a lot of dangerous things in the house.
#10 Lots of problems here for a variety of reasons. That would require basically a tax and more government neither of which we need. HIPPA would forego the health check ups. A buy back would be fine and has actually happened on small scale in a lot of places. A semi auto ban is just silly they have their place in hunting, and the vast majority of pistols are semi auto. As for hunting, especially for things like the invasive boars in the south, taking away the semi auto would definitely hurt the hunters. Gun shops are well regulated and are already pretty few and far between. Maybe take away mega stores ability to sell them? Why limit ammo and if we did how much? I shoot probably 60 round a year in my primary hunting rifle. When I was a kid a box cost about $5 which is 20 rounds. It is now about $25 and like with all things will just continue to rise. I wish I had the means and forethough back then to buy in bulk just to save money. I think you overestimate the ease of buying a gun. Going back to statistics most gun related deaths happen with pistols and nation wide you already can only buy one in the state you reside in.
I really do believe in common sence gun laws, but they must be carefully written. For instance, while not exactly easy, it’s also not super hard to convert some models from semi auto to full. There has to be some way in manufacturing to prevent it or at least make it much harder. A somewhat harder background check that might take a few days or a week also fine. Stricter consequences for breaking the law with a firearm. Restricting ammo that really does have no regular use like armor piercing, exploding etc.
There is already a proposal to ban bump stocks. Just so you know this is really a red herring. Those are kind of stupid for several reasons. I’m betting the NRA folks are going to put up a fight just for the perceived look and then concede, because they will really lose nothing and the far left will feel they have gained something.
Thank you, Gabby, for your post and the thoughtful, thought-provoking discussion you’ve fostered here.
Thinking about what protecting my family means, I have a question for you. How do you deal with the possibility of guns in other people’s homes, especially homes where your children might be without you? Do you ask your kids’ friends’ parents if they own guns, and, if so, how they store them? Would you let your kids go to their friends’ houses if their parents do own guns?
My kids are still very little, so they’re not going to friends’ houses without me yet, and we live in an area where there’s not a lot of gun ownership — but still, how can I take that chance?
I really appreciate this post. I wanted to add that the information we need to have an effective conversation about this issue is being squelched. I have a friend who is a public health researcher whose findings pointed out that guns are a massive public health problem. This is a person who was ex special forces military, a true patriot who has had lots of intimate experience with guns, btw. He chose to give up doing the research after receiving terrifying threats towards himself and his family. It just wasn’t worth it to him (and his wife and small children). It makes me so sad that there is so much venom in all of this that researchers cannot even safely sort out whether what we think about guns is true. I come from a family of hunters. I don’t want everyone to lose their guns. I just want people to be safer and do believe there are some regulatory ways we could make that happen. I think a majority of people feel that way and folks who have a financial interest in selling firearms (and a small group of political extremists) are having an undue and deadly impact on our country.
Thanks for your thoughtful post, I agree with you – change is desperately needed. As an Australian I struggle to understand the pro gun culture of the US. TBH, nobody is saying, for example, that a farmer can’t have a weapon. We have guns in Australia. People use them. But I couldn’t walk down to Kmart and buy one behind the counter in a whim. And I shouldn’t be able to! i don’t know how someone, for example, can amass 30+ guns without anyone questioning why. There are simple pain medications you can’t get even 2 packets of over the counter at a pharmacy without being scrutinised. The mind boggles.
Even with population stats taken into account (see article below), no country comes close to the USA when it comes to risk of death from guns.
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/06/14/upshot/compare-these-gun-death-rates-the-us-is-in-a-different-world.html
I struggle to understand why the reaction (from the powers that be) to such senseless violence, repeated tragedy, and loss of life on such a major scale 😭, is NOT to look at gun control with a magnifying glass. It seems like it would be the logical first step. But clearly logic doesn’t have anything to do with it. It’s all about emotion.
I know the language (consider yourself warned!) in this link is intense, and of course he is a comedian ….. However if you can look past this, he actually does make some Interesting observations.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4g8777
Such a good point – you can’t buy more than 2 packets of Sudafed but go to Dick’s Sporting Goods and buy yourself a weapon. Or 30.
Hi guys!!
So I’m a long time reader and have followed you since you lived in France!! ;)
Im really glad you DIDNT say I want to take your guns away- because I think that is precisely the kind of language that makes certain people desire to go buy more guns for fear that they will be taken away.
I’m curious as to if anyone has researched what happened in England with their gun law reform?
Their was a segment on CNN that said that in England, when they took away guns the crimes from guns actually increased. They said that here in America burglars are very scared if they break in that someone with a gun inside will shoot them so it prevents a lot of break ins and burglaries. And they said in England it actually increased death by guns.
So I’m wondering about that.
However, I think that we should have stricter laws. I think making it harder to purchase guns is a necessity.
However I grew up with people who do not want any change to gun laws at all, and many times every time this subject arises and they hear people push to reform the laws, they purchase another gun- out of fear.
There is a lot of fear from people, from what I’ve heard when I’ve asked, about protecting themselves from people and even from the government. Some of my friends are scared that one day the government will try to “overtake” the country and become communist.
They’ve also been fearful of burglars. Its a huge fear. I think having a burglar alarm and a dog is a great suggestion, as someone suggested above. But I know some people don’t feel thats enough.
I think this discussion is a great entry way to hear both sides. Because nothing will happen unless both sides feel they’re HEARD and that their fears are listened to.
But I think that we at some point have got to talk about the rise of violent nature and rise of mental illness in this country.
Are video games a problem?
Are rap songs with graphic violence in the words a problem.
I feel like there is a rise in interpersonal arguments and conflict. Great divorce rates.
Greater increase in domestic violence than there was in the 1950’s. Whats the cause, and whats the solution?
How can people help others who struggle with rage?
I think that violence is more visible in the western world, definitely. We have much a wealth of media that shows us violence all the time – factual media showing us conflicts in the Middle East and mass shootings closer to home, and entertainment where action films are hails of bullets and celebrations of vigilante violence, and TV shows are full of crime.
In terms of video games, from what I understand, there’s no direct effect of violence on people: playing a violent videogame does not make somebody violent. it’s easy to doubt the science there – I think it’s hard to believe in your heart! Perhaps there is something about violent people seeking out violent experiences – so if you are already violent, you’re more likely to watch a violent film, play a violent videogame, etc, and that reinforces your tendancies.
But whether there is actually more violence about is a different thing. There’s an argument that humanity has been getting less violent (Steve Pinker wrote a whole book about it, ‘The Better Angels of our Nature’ – see https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21228340-100-steven-pinker-humans-are-less-violent-than-ever/) I would really like to believe that, and I definitely think that in some ways we are. I wonder why it wouldn’t show in the media we consume?
I agree!! why wouldn’t the media show that? Maybe we need to be more intentional about showing that ourselves. I think there are so many kind things people do day in and day out but don’t share those things for fear of bragging. I know this is a different topic, but I do wish the media would share that.
I wonder also if anyone knows if prescription drugs and the rise of those has an affect on the violence and shootings? Somewhere on the news said that they are researching this.
Gabby, your first point stuck in my mind and I was turning it over on the way home yesterday: “When I say I want stricter gun control, they hear ‘I want to take your guns away.’ ” I wonder whether it goes further than that: they are actually hearing ‘I want to take away your power’ or ‘I want to take away your safety’? Because those are surely the two things that guns represent.
Being from the UK, it’s hard to see the current state of the US gun control laws are anything other than utterly, utterly crazy. Particularly when you hear statistics like ‘In the first 10 months of 2015, there were 43 ‘toddler shootings’ in the US ‘. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/14/people-are-getting-shot-by-toddlers-on-a-weekly-basis-this-year/?utm_term=.430b87715e48) I just can’t see how the right to bear arms wins out over the right to life.
But then you can’t really change people’s hearts with statistics. My husband pointed ou this really interesting cartoon that explains why:
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/believe.
I appreciated your honesty and straightforwardness on addressing the gun control issue. Thank you.
Thanks for your thoughtful post which has inspired such a thoughtful conversation. I have so many thoughts on this, but will just share this one: imagine the jobs that would be created if we had stronger regulations on gun ownership. Something akin to the DMV. Not sure how this plays into political will to change policy- creating jobs looks good, but paying more government employees is a fiscal challenge.
Thanks for posting this and thanks for trying to find a way to engage in this topic that, as Trevor Noah pointed out in his show the other night, seems so off-limits, so ‘don’t go there’, so explosive.
When you can’t even talk about something, how do you begin to address it? It is mind-boggling and infuriating, the lengths policymakers will go to to address security issues – forcing the public to relinquish all manner of other rights in the process – all while refusing to deal with the elephant in the room.
I’m an American living outside the U.S. for nearly a decade. I’d like to move back but two major deterrents are guns and the healthcare mess.
Maybe a different way to start this conversation is: ‘Why are you afraid to lose your guns?’ or ‘If it’s your mother, daughter, son, brother, or sister getting shot while they’re attending a concert or a movie or going to school – will you be okay with that? Will knowing that you have a weapon make that loss easier to bear?’
I agree with you 1,000% and am always so grateful to you for bringing these tough topics to the forefront in such a thoughtful way. I’d like to see a world with NO guns, but I know I won’t win that battle, so really more of a focus on much tougher gun restrictions would be great (I love the many month waiting period, with calls to several family members to ask questions about your motivations, emotions, etc., all of which they do in other countries with great success!). Again, thank you! I love your blog and always find myself nodding along and muttering “amen” and “YAAS!” as I’m reading your posts.
I think if a sea-change is going to happen for real, it’s going to have to be cultural at least in part. Americans worship guns. It’s in our music, it’s in our movies…. I’ve seen some articles on the interwebs advocating that parents start asking other parents if they have a gun in the house before having a playdate (in the same way you’d screen for allergens if your kid has a food allergy), and then if the answer is “yes” investigate whether this friend is a responsible gun owner (“Are all of your guns in a safe? What kind of security does the safe have?”) and not be afraid to decline playdates at the house (but offer to meet out or at your place) if you don’t feel comfortable. I think it’s going to take this kind of social pressure in the same way that social pressure has been a part of the decline in smoking rates.
This is the most well researched and fair analysis of gun control I’ve read in the wake of Las Vegas. I wholeheartedly believe that no one should own guns and that the 2nd amendment should be abolished but I know my opinions are extreme and that they will never be realized. My husband owns many guns that he used for sport/hunting and I have refused to have them in my home. I don’t understand the need and feel that gun owners are putting their supposed need for guns ahead of other’s safety. There is no way the 2nd amendment was meant to give people the right to own weapons like the ones used in Sunday’s shooting. I hope Congress can some how find the courage to stand up to the NRA like they did to the tobacco industry. Thanks, as always, for fostering an important conversation.
Maybe I am naive but I can’t imagine wanting to protect my family by shooting someone. Living with the loss of a family member would be horrific but I can’t imagine how it would feel to know I’ve killed (or seriously injured) someone.
Am I alone in thinking this way?
Thanks for posting so thoughtfully, Gabby! I applaud your restraint on FB also.
Monday night after the shooting I spent too much time reading and watching about Las Vegas. I’ve always believed in order to enact change, you must do the following :
1 – Remove the emotion from the issue
2 – Try to understand where the other side is coming from
I’ve never been a fan of guns. I shot a target pistol once, for 3 shots, hit all my targets, crossed that off the list.
Spent 2 hours perusing the NRA website. By the time I was finished, can honestly say that I get their viewpoint. The perception (falsely or not) that guns provide protection. It’s a fact that guns are guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment and to some owning a gun is viewed as a right and to some a hallowed milestone or family legacy.
On the other hand, mass murders keep happening and precious family members, friends and children are killed. It must stop.
What we’ve done to date isn’t working, so let’s innovate.
Put the onus of change on the NRA. They have 90 days to come up with a viable, fact-based plan to eliminate gun-induced mass murders. All other pending NRA related legislation will be halted during the 90 days and all lobbying will cease during the 90 day period. The NRA must treat this as a life-or-death matter of the highest importance. If no viable plan is created by the 91st day, the NRA will lose their 501 (c) (3) tax-exempt status.
I’d also propose a change to video games. Once you “kill” a target, you’re done with the game. And any points you’ve accumulated are transferred to the family of the target you’ve killed.
Wacky ideas, right?? They sure are! Unless we radically brainstorm in order to change the status quo, we’re wasting our time.
More ideas…..
Random home inspections by law enforcement to make sure your weapons are legal, locked away safely and you’re up-to-date on proper firearm safety. If you fail the inspection, you pay a substantial fine. If it happens again, you forfeit the right to own guns.
Create a Victims/Survivors Fund for Mass Murders funded by the NRA and a special 10% tax on all gun sales going forward.
Like I said, wacky ideas.
Me again, Gabby.
3 more innocents were killed in Thornton, CO (less than 25 miles away from where I live) by a shooter who calmly walked away after firing his gun.
Numerous witnesses brandished their concealed guns but no one fired. By pulling their weapons, the announcement that the shooter was still on the loose was delayed by 5 hours since the police had to comb thru the security tapes and determine who the actual shooter was. Thankfully he was arrested 14 hours later.
We’ve got to stop this madness.
Thanks for listening <3
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and ideas. I started reading through all the comments and enjoyed reading those as well but it was taking too long – ha! I grew up in the rural south and we always had guns. They were in an unlocked gun cabinet and one rifle was always loaded. After I graduated with my masters and began working, it was sort of shocking to me that so many of my coworkers knew nothing about guns and seemed to be truly terrified of them (this was almost 20 years ago). Of course they were shocked that I wasn’t afraid of guns and had grown up in a home with free access to guns. I can’t speak for, nor would I want to try, people who grow up in non-rural environments. For me, they were part of life. My family were all hunters. We went to deer camp every year, as did every one else’s families. (Side note but I remember a Candian colleague thinking deer camp was where you went to a camp where deer lived – ha! For those who don’t know, it’s a strong family tradition in the south where families have specific plots of land where they camp during deer hunting season. People go out early in the morning, hunt all day, come back to camp with whatever they killed, dress it, eat dinner, play cards/dominos and go to bed to do it all again the next day.) Since we lived in the country, our guns were also used to kill snakes, coyotes, and other critters who posed a threat to our or our animal’s well being. I learned to shoot when I was 9. Two of my first dates in high school involved shooting practice.
Because I’ve lived in cities for the last 20 years, I now have a broader understanding of how different the way of life is for urban versus rural families. I feel like I have an appreciation for both and a respect for both. We don’t own guns because I don’t really feel the need and am frankly out of practice with shooting and my husband did not grow up with guns. I think it’s better for our family to not own one as a result. That said, I have no issues with my parents owning guns so long as they are locked (which they are) and our children do not have access to them when they are at their home. My dad still hunts and they eat the meat all year that comes from his hunting.
There was a boy my age who accidentally killed his little brother with a family gun which was terribly tragic (and part of why I don’t personally want to have a gun in our home) but even at that time, it was viewed as irresponsibility on the part of the parents which it was (tragically). There were far more kids injured or killed in accidents involving farm equipment so the gun death was an outlier.
This has gotten too long but thought I’d share a perspective of someone from a rural background who grew up with guns as a necessary part of life to eat and protect (protect from animals by the way, not people).
Hunting rifles are not the problem. It is other types of fire arms!
I am very comfortable taking everyone’s guns away. We would all be much better off if no one had guns.
A 19 yr cannot buy a can of beer in the country but they can legally buy a semi automatic weapon? How does this make any sense?
Yes I was shocked that it was legal to buy a gun at that age. I heard that Florida also has very lenient gun laws compared to other states.
How sad that you already had a perfect post ready to recycle, from only a couple of months ago….
As more and more people are killed in high-profile shooting massacres, will more American constituencies start caring about gun control? For example, will Floridians start pushing harder for gun control now (if the Pulse shooting wasn’t motivational enough…). Will Mormons care more this time because victim Alaina Petty was Mormon? Will more Republicans reconsider their love affair with the NRA?
Coverage of this high school shooting, the Texas church one, and the Las Vegas music festival one haven’t been too clouded with a bunch of side issues like immigration, politics, and hate crimes. Yet I’ve still seen a lot of totally ancillary issues raised, like “why are video games so violent? Doesn’t that harden our youth and make them more like to shoot real guns?” Well, maybe, but you still need to get a real gun to shoot it, so gun control is still the more fundamental issue.
My dad has a ton of guns and is in the NRA, and yesterday he said no one should be able to buy an AR-15. So maybe others are slowly changing their minds too?
I find that last line about your dad hopeful. I think responsible gun owners (like your dad) need to be strong voice in advocating for change.
I agree with EVERY single thing you have written in this post. I do not own a gun and never will. The only insights that I would add are: 1. My best friend surprised me several years ago by saying that her husband had guns and then last year she asked him to teach her to shoot. When I asked her about it she said they had gone to a lecture years ago after hurricane Katrina and the lecturer told them he had been all over the world helping with disasters and often there was an element of violence that he felt necessitated the need to have a way to protect your family. This doesn’t stand up for me because lately we have had disasters and all you hear about are people helping each other. But perhaps the idea of extreme situations (which we do seem to be having more of) contributes to the feeling to have a gun for some people? Secondly, my brother has a college friend that he does not think is mentally healthy but he recently found out this individual bought a gun. This man does not have anything that would come up bad on a background check and has never sought counseling—there is no paper trail or diagnosis to point to. Just my brother’s opinion as his former college roommate. What can we do? I feel like there is nothing really in place to take guns away from people like this young man. There needs to be more in place. We need it to change.
Oh man. I honestly don’t know what the right action would be as far as the unstable roommate goes. Has anyone reading successfully dealt with something like this?
The headlines might as well read “Coming soon to a school near you . . . ”
My child was in first grade when the first graders at Sandy Hook were murdered.
We are not over it.
It sucks that I have had to discuss another school massacre with my children, but I’m grateful I am talking with them instead of about them.
I grew up in New York City and attended public school and took public transportation on my own.
Now I live in a nice suburb with good public schools and my kids seem less safe than I was in the “big, bad city.”
What strange math leads anyone to believe more guns = fewer deaths?
When I read your last line, I was reminded of a tweet I saw this morning:
I know for sure that this is an emotional topic because my family and I have been affected by gun violence, and we have ended up on opposite sides of the spectrum. My cousin committed suicide when he was pulled over by a cop because there happened to be a gun in the car. He had already attempted suicide twice over the past two years, but was unsuccessful because he had tried less fatal means and was found and saved.
Up to this point I didn’t really have any feelings one way or another about guns. I was 21, I had grown up around uncles who hunted, they lived in a more rural area, and I had even gone with them once. We lived in the suburbs, I don’t know if we owned any guns, and we didn’t talk about it as a family.
After this experience I firmly fell on the side of gun control and limiting access to guns. My cousin would not have died that day if he did not have access to a gun. Since then I have studied suicide a lot and work in the mental health industry. Suicide is usually an impulsive decision, and if a person is impeded in being able to carry out their decision they don’t typically find another route because that moment of impulsivity has passed.
My family since then has moved more and more into a pro-gun culture. They make statements like “I’ll die before I let the government take my guns”.
I do not understand their fear on that side at all, but I am terrified of losing another loved one to a gun. Thank you for this write up, it is the most helpful thing I have read about gun control in a while.
Your thoughts on suicide being an impulsive decision really hit home for me. I’m someone who has experienced deep depression that has made me long for death, and it’s very unpredictable. If there was a gun in our house, the chance of me committing suicide would be very high.
I used to this the same way as you with regard to this thought: “I definitely want you to be able to keep your guns, but….”
But you know what, now I do want to take your guns away. Why do you need them? I want to take them all away. I live each day with a pit in my stomach as I send my young children to school. Why do we have to live like this? Maybe we should start having an honest conversation about wanting to take ALL THE GUNS AWAY!!!!!!!
Maybe it’s just in the air right now, but I’ve been hearing a lot of that. One thought that occurred to me yesterday is this: A majority of American citizens have been asking, demanding, begging for improvements to our gun safety laws for a long time. The asks have been reasonable and accommodating. The asks have been small changes and simple fixes — like closing the gun show loopholes, or universal background checks. That same majority of Americans who want better gun regulations have listened to opposing views and acknowledged how unique and important our constitutional amendments are. But still, despite the patience, and small asks, and focus on common sense, and wide bi-partisan support for change, no action has been taken.
Have people reached the point where the majority of Americans are no longer willing to be accommodating about this? Are people feeling like: Hey, we tried to do this in small ways that wouldn’t freak you out, but you wouldn’t compromise even an inch. And now we’re done talking about small ways. We want all guns gone. Our patience is officially exhausted. You had your chance, but you weren’t willing to work with us, and now you’re going to lose your gun privileges.
I don’t know if that’s really how people are feeling right now, but if it is, I get it. And like I said, I’ve been seeing lots of comments similar to yours in the last few days.
So much of this debate misses the mark so to speak when it comes to addressing our inherent proclivity to sin. We (as people) are capable of so much destruction and we absolutely need our Savior to wipe away the bitterness and stronghold of evil which can wreak havoc in our lives and the lives of others. Freedom from internal darkness is closer than we think.
Those truths stated, that doesn’t take away from our own free will and ability/responsibility to do the right things.
Will people bent on harming others find a way to carry out their deeds? Yes. Will those same people find it harder to enact their destruction in mass amounts if the tools they are searching for are not available? I think the short answer is also yes.
Two points have brought home with such tremendous weight how devastating these tragedies really are.
The first point is the overwhelming documented evidence of how much money politicians, who make policy which affects this situation, have been given by a Goliath of an industry (NRA) whose own record of caring for the interest of anything but their pocket books has been miserable and also well-documented.
The second point is just two of the articles (see links below) which describe in visceral detail the horrific consequences of gunshot wounds. Unless we are on the frontline, as these interviewed people are, then we have a sanitized, dare I say romanticized, view of what gun violence and its outcome looks like. Just reading these first hand accounts is an emotional feat; imagine living it as the victim or the various caregivers.
I am not naive and know that even within other countries where guns are scarce, those who deeply desire to have a gun for nefarious purposes will often make their own or find a way to obtain one illegally. Like I said earlier, this is a deeper heart issue. BUT, the lengths at which they have to go to in order to find an assault style weapon is much more involved than what these openly disturbed murderers we have seen had to do to obtain their chosen weapons.
The second amendment was written with sensibility and had sensibility in mind. May our country heed those perimeters.
Thank you so much Gabby for this open forum for your readers to sound off and have our voices heard. My heart is breaking and it is good to be able to share thoughts that keep ruminating through my head.
http://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/gun-violence/
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/15/opinion/virginia-baseball-shooting-gun-shot-wounds.html
My cousin lives in Parkland and two of the victims were in her ward and had babysat her children. As I dropped my daughter off at middle school this morning, the thought ran through my head that the next shooting could be at her school and for all I knew this could be the last time I ever saw her alive. Congress HAS to do SOMETHING. Any one solution won’t be perfect but they need to TRY.
I think I read a quote here, actually, years ago, about how once we decided we were okay with the death of 20 children (when nothing was done after Sandy Hook), that nothing would ever change. This has become so routine it barely registers unless the number of deaths is extraordinary, which is terrifying. I don’t have much to add except that I think the claimed fear of burglary/home invasion is bogus. I live in an urban area and I know far more people whose homes have burned down due to furnace/electrical problems, etc. (3) than who have experienced a home invasion or burglary (none). I’ve also lived in Paris, Brussels, and Mexico City, and I sometimes felt unsafe. But even if I thought I would experience something terrible (and fortunately I never did), I at least thought I would survive. I never thought I would be shot dead, which is what I think about when I think about crime in the U.S. I now routinely walk into a building and think about where the exits are and how I would protect myself in case of a shooting. I am far more worried about an American with guns than I am about any sort of terrorist. And I am so saddened that lockdown drills are a routine thing for my children.
I’m reading from the UK and things are so different here. My husband owns a gun, it’s a shot gun bought specifically for shooting pigeons and practicing at clay pigeon shoots (I think in the US it’s called skeet shooting). Before he was allowed to buy it he had to apply for a licence and install a gun safe and to get that licence a police officer visited to check we were all sane people and the safe was installed appropriately. Incidently I am not allowed to know where the keys are, and my children definitely can’t open it! I felt pretty weird when if was first brought into the house. Growing up, the only people I knew with a gun lived on a farm and we don’t so it’s a bit odd.
I’m also a teacher, and the idea that I would have to protect my students from gunfire is inconcievable – and I work at a school with cadets and a firing range!!
I know the US isn’t the UK and we have plenty of problems of our own, but we see the news and it is always heartbreaking and it always seems so preventable. This year has seen women of the music and film industries stand up and say no more. Please let it now be time when America says enough to automatic weapons that murder children.